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> Used older Lance 815????, Seeking buying advice...

KennVFRidr
post Mar 10 2017, 03:46 PM
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Favorite Truck Camper(s): Still lookin
Type and Brand of Truck(s) Owned: 07 Ford F-250 Ext Cab SB 4x4 V10
Type of Tiedowns used: None
Truck and Camper Setup: Coming soon...



We're looking to buy our first camper...and wondering if there are any specific trouble spots to look out for with an older Lance 815. There are a couple we might look at, a 2004, and a 2005...both look decent in pictures...and both located at dealerships a couple hours away. Priced at 6,999, and 10,995.

We snagged an 85,000 mile 2007 F-250 SD, Ext Cab, SB, V-10, looking for a smallish lighter weight slide-in camper.

Any thoughts and/or perspective appreciated.

Thanks in advance...
Kenn

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SidecarFlip
post Mar 10 2017, 08:39 PM
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Favorite Truck Camper(s): Forest River Palomino SS
Type and Brand of Truck(s) Owned: 1997 Ford F350 4x4 LB SRW CC 7.3 diesel
Type of Tiedowns used: HappyJac standard
Truck and Camper Setup: 1997 Ford F350 4 door 4x4 Crew Cab 7.3 Diesel, Lance 915 loaded, 2015 Palomino SS1500 Loaded



One comment. The older 815's will weigh over 2000 pounds dry. Water, battery. food, propane and stuff will push the weight past 2500 pounds, quite a charge for a 3/4 ton pickup.

Those prices are a bit on the steep side as well. More like 3-4 in good condition with everything operating.
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KennVFRidr
post Mar 10 2017, 10:45 PM
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Group: Members
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Member No.: 9,287
Favorite Truck Camper(s): Still lookin
Type and Brand of Truck(s) Owned: 07 Ford F-250 Ext Cab SB 4x4 V10
Type of Tiedowns used: None
Truck and Camper Setup: Coming soon...



QUOTE(SidecarFlip @ Mar 10 2017, 05:39 PM)
One comment.  The older 815's will weigh over 2000 pounds dry.  Water, battery. food, propane and stuff will push the weight past 2500 pounds, quite a charge for a 3/4 ton pickup.

Those prices are a bit on the steep side as well.  More like 3-4 in good condition with everything operating.
*



Thanks for the input...I was wondering about the listings...I think both ads listed the weight as 1795lbs dry...wasn't sure where reality set in...weighed in... ;-)

I figured I'd make a low offer if one looks as good in person...we'll see..

Thanks again...
Kenn
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SidecarFlip
post Mar 11 2017, 11:20 AM
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Group: Members
Posts: 472
Joined: 15-October 16
Member No.: 9,221
Favorite Truck Camper(s): Forest River Palomino SS
Type and Brand of Truck(s) Owned: 1997 Ford F350 4x4 LB SRW CC 7.3 diesel
Type of Tiedowns used: HappyJac standard
Truck and Camper Setup: 1997 Ford F350 4 door 4x4 Crew Cab 7.3 Diesel, Lance 915 loaded, 2015 Palomino SS1500 Loaded



1795 is a 'pie in the sky' weight. Maybe a bare frame with no appliances installed or water or propane tanks or ac unit, maybe.

Camper manufacturers tend to greatly reduce advertised weight from what they actually are. It's a 'feel good' think, just like using the term 'Lite' in a camper name. All pie in the sky.
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KennVFRidr
post Mar 11 2017, 01:00 PM
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Group: Members
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Joined: 28-November 16
Member No.: 9,287
Favorite Truck Camper(s): Still lookin
Type and Brand of Truck(s) Owned: 07 Ford F-250 Ext Cab SB 4x4 V10
Type of Tiedowns used: None
Truck and Camper Setup: Coming soon...



QUOTE(SidecarFlip @ Mar 11 2017, 08:20 AM)
1795 is a 'pie in the sky' weight.  Maybe a bare frame with no appliances installed or water or propane tanks or ac unit, maybe.

Camper manufacturers tend to greatly reduce advertised weight from what they actually are.  It's a 'feel good' think, just like using the term 'Lite' in a camper name.  All pie in the sky.
*



We'd really like to get the Northstar Liberty...but even it will max out the load capabilities of our truck...and buying new will take every dime I have...and that might not be enough. I still have a lot to learn...but it appears that most 3/4 trucks and campers are walking a pretty fine line between the trucks stated load capabilities and actual load heading down the road.

Still trying to get all the numbers rattling around in my head squared away...and hoping to get best setup we can afford...and do it safely...but it starting to seem like I'll need a spreadsheet expert to layout all the details in order to make the right choices for our situation... blink.gif

Thanks again for your input...
Kenn
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SidecarFlip
post Mar 11 2017, 02:10 PM
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Group: Members
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Favorite Truck Camper(s): Forest River Palomino SS
Type and Brand of Truck(s) Owned: 1997 Ford F350 4x4 LB SRW CC 7.3 diesel
Type of Tiedowns used: HappyJac standard
Truck and Camper Setup: 1997 Ford F350 4 door 4x4 Crew Cab 7.3 Diesel, Lance 915 loaded, 2015 Palomino SS1500 Loaded



Ken.. Even though I'm adverse to financing anything, I financed my newest camper. Got a 10 year loan at 5.25% which I never intended on running term, but at 114 bucks a month, it's pretty easy to budget and make multiple payments. I certainly don't have that much cash laying around.

Financing one is a good option so long as you don't intend on running a loan to term. Remember Rule 53 applies to any and all consumer loans so there is never a pre-payment penalty, thats Federal Law.

I see there is a 4 wheel camper listed on here for sale. 4 wheel campers are light, aluminum framed units, very quality build. It's a pop up though, not a hard side. I may have a look see, myself.
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RV_Tech
post Mar 12 2017, 09:22 AM
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Favorite Truck Camper(s): Hallmark, Northstar, Outfitter
Type and Brand of Truck(s) Owned: F-350 SRW 6.2 Supercab
Type of Tiedowns used: Happijack front, Torklift rear
Truck and Camper Setup: Hallmark Ute XL No modes to truck Torklift Fast Guns Fast guns had to be cut down to absolute minimum (14 1/2") to use with Happijac front tie down and Hallmark camper.



QUOTE(KennVFRidr @ Mar 11 2017, 02:00 PM)
We'd really like to get the Northstar Liberty...but even it will max out the load capabilities of our truck...and buying new will take every dime I have...and that might not be enough.  I still have a lot to learn...but it appears that most 3/4 trucks and campers are walking a pretty fine line between the trucks stated load capabilities and actual load heading down the road. 

Still trying to get all the numbers rattling around in my head squared away...and hoping to get best setup we can afford...and do it safely...but it starting to seem like I'll need a spreadsheet expert to layout all the details in order to make the right choices for our situation...    blink.gif

Thanks again for your input...
Kenn
*




I have been muddling through all of this for weeks of reading here and in other truck camper forums. What I discovered is the general consensus is to add 1,000 pounds to the listed dry weight to get close to what is more likely the actual wet weight on the truck. I recall one comment that truck camper manufacturers listed what they wished their camper weighed rather than what it actually weighed.

And to get the truck payload, the only thing that works is to have the truck loaded as you would travel, drive to a CAT scale, and pay the money to weigh it (that part is easy).

Where I ended up with the weight issue is I would be amazed to find more than a very small percentage of trucks are running within the manufacturers' weight ratings hauling truck campers (though I could be wrong on this point). This led me to consider only the lightest truck campers I could find and eliminating many with tankage I would prefer.

I had naively hoped, when switching to a truck camper from our fifth wheel, that there might be a greater degree of transparency from manufacturers, but have found despite strong statements not to go beyond manufacturer's ratings in the brochures many truck campers seem targeted toward trucks where there is little if any hope of staying within ratings.

So with truck campers, as with every other type of RV the old axiom holds true, "let the buyer beware!" sad.gif

Steve
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SidecarFlip
post Mar 12 2017, 03:07 PM
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Group: Members
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Member No.: 9,221
Favorite Truck Camper(s): Forest River Palomino SS
Type and Brand of Truck(s) Owned: 1997 Ford F350 4x4 LB SRW CC 7.3 diesel
Type of Tiedowns used: HappyJac standard
Truck and Camper Setup: 1997 Ford F350 4 door 4x4 Crew Cab 7.3 Diesel, Lance 915 loaded, 2015 Palomino SS1500 Loaded



I see these campers with double slides and rear entry and all sorts of convenience features and I thnk to myself... "thats a BARGE....'

The is see them on SRW trucks (not dullays) and I think, thsats. a real BARGE

My issue with that scenario is more about overloaded component life and braking ability in an emergency situation more that wanting to own a barge.

On the Open Roads forum so guy just bought a Host Mammoth with (are you ready)... a frigg'in fireplace, quartz countertops and every imaginable feature. Wonder what it weighs?

Gonna but it on a 1 ton dullay and I bet he's at least 2000 pounds over capacity if he's a pound over.

I don't get it. You want to co camping or glamping and impress the other campers? Not me. I ain't hauling a barge.

The biggest untruth in the RV business is the weight plate that manufacturers place on their units. Big fantasy.

I figure my Palomino SS1500 fully loaded, with 2 occupants in the cab weighs close to 2800 pounds (cargo weight) and thats a soft side. I'm sure my old Lance was around 3400 though I never weighed it. it 'felt' like it was. Tack on a couple slides and fru-fru crap and I would have been pushing 4K

In a lot of ways, you are better off with a pull behind or 5er, especially from a safety standpoint as well as a component life standpoint.

I see people hauling around full size hard side TC in Tundra's and I shake my head and I surely don't want to be in front of them and have to perform an emergency stop because I'm gonna get rear ended. That Tundra with a slide in on it cannot stop, don't have enough brakes. I don't care if the driver is pushing the pedal through the firewall, just not enough there.
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RV_Tech
post Mar 12 2017, 05:36 PM
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Group: Members
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Joined: 27-July 12
Member No.: 6,199
Favorite Truck Camper(s): Hallmark, Northstar, Outfitter
Type and Brand of Truck(s) Owned: F-350 SRW 6.2 Supercab
Type of Tiedowns used: Happijack front, Torklift rear
Truck and Camper Setup: Hallmark Ute XL No modes to truck Torklift Fast Guns Fast guns had to be cut down to absolute minimum (14 1/2") to use with Happijac front tie down and Hallmark camper.



Your comment about braking is an important one. While a truck camper weighs a lot less than a towable, the only stoppers you have are those on the truck. If you ever doubt the power of towable brakes, pull the pin on the break-away switch. Those camper brakes will just about throw you through the windshield, so you always have a bit of a back up. Not so when you have a camper riding piggyback on your truck.

It would be interesting to do some braking tests and note stopping distances from some of these overloaded truck campers.

Steve
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SidecarFlip
post Mar 12 2017, 09:31 PM
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Group: Members
Posts: 472
Joined: 15-October 16
Member No.: 9,221
Favorite Truck Camper(s): Forest River Palomino SS
Type and Brand of Truck(s) Owned: 1997 Ford F350 4x4 LB SRW CC 7.3 diesel
Type of Tiedowns used: HappyJac standard
Truck and Camper Setup: 1997 Ford F350 4 door 4x4 Crew Cab 7.3 Diesel, Lance 915 loaded, 2015 Palomino SS1500 Loaded



I don't want to be the tester and I don't want to pay for the damage either.

I know when I pull my gooseneck trailer (tandem axle with brakes on every wheel), even overloaded and I'm usually overloaded, hay is heavy, I can relly tell the difference when I set the gain up on the brake controller, stops right now.

I have twin piston Girlings fron and rear on my 1997 (refitted discs over the drums) and I still allow plenty of stopping distance with the camper on the truck. never felt like I was running out of brake but why chance it.

People put TC's on smaller trucks like Tacoma's and Tundra's and they don't have the brake capacity in the first place.

I went through Eaton Corporation's Defensive Driving Course in Marshall, Michigan twice and you get to do real life simulations in real vehicles on skid pads where the instructor is actually controlling brake functions remotely in big trucks, parcel vans and cars. Quite an eye opening experience. Noting puckers your butt end like a wet skid pad and brake failure. More than one student went off the end, down the bank and had to get pulled out. All in fun though. I recommend it if you can get admission,.

They teach you threshold braking, skid avoidance, how to steer out of a skid (with a semi and that is interesting in itself), panic stopping on wet and dry surfaces and lots of classroom theory on brake systems, brake fade and about tires and how they behave in different loading situations, under inflated and over inflated.

Did it twice and it guarantees sweaty palms.

Some of th TC's I see going down thew road, I know are way overloaded and I wonder how many pull behind's and 5er's have marginal brake systems. I bet a lot.

When you put a TC in the bed and you have to add springs and levelling blocks to level the truck, it's overloaded. No way around that. You can make it appear to be level and right but it's over capacity for the suspension, brakes and driveline.

I confess, I run air bags but I run them not for levelling the bed but to take the kick out of my gooseneck. When I have the camper in the truck, I usually have about 10 psi in the bags, don't need any more. My overload leaf never contacts the upper mount, usually I have at least 2" of space.

I always run my tires at maximum stated pressure, in my case 80 psi with bolt on metal valve stems. No rubber stems for me. Don't want or need a tire issue.
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